难道抗日战争的历史真相就真的那么可怕吗？

七种武器之喷子

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 14:42
I don't think I have say China system is no good, I just wondering why people love to torture them ...

are you talking about hk?

jerrygarry

七种武器之喷子 发表于 2014-9-10 14:53
are you talking about hk?

Yeah man, I think they should all go! haha

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 14:49
My background have taught me nothing good from totalirian government - so that's my background

...

不错， 好的开始， 你现在才知道关于“制度”的问题， 证明你的 background洗脑比我们大陆厉害多了， 起码我们从小学开始就知道政府在洗脑， 而你到现在还不知道你的background同样在洗你脑.

我们也讨厌老毛， 但公道地说， 所谓他感谢日本侵华一段， 你只看到断章取义的一节， 而没有看完全文后理，就跟着人云亦云， 这就是你background的洗脑作用。让你丧失求证的基本能力.

蓝山小野猫商铺

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 14:41
Because we have difference background - go to any Hong Kong and Taiwan group and facebook you see  ...

民主 一天到晚喊 民主。。。

你倒是告诉我什么是民主？？？！！！

当初香港被英国统治的时候 连港督都是英国直接任命的。。。

你可有普选港督的权利？？？！！！

英国统治的时候 港督直接任命在你们眼中就叫民主了？？？！！！

来到现在2014年喊普选。。。

这都什么跟什么啊？？？！！！

好好回家想想这个逻辑关系 回来再喊民主。。。

全世界没有一个国家真正实现过民主。。。

因为世界都是有人来构造的 每个人的血液里面都流淌着自私的天性。。。

每个所谓的阶级都是为了维护自己阶级的利益 说的难听点就是维护自己本身的利益 与其他人无关。。。

”民主“跟马克思的”共产主义“一样乌托邦。。。

只是平民百姓自己安慰自己所想出来的玩意儿而已。。。

正如宗教一样。。。

你信民主 那么你即便生活在非洲的极度落后封闭的极端统治的部落里面 你还依然觉得你拥有了民主。。。

如果你不信民主 那么即便你生活在只有你一个人的国度 你还依然觉得你被压迫。。。

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 14:55
不错， 好的开始， 你现在才知道关于“制度”的问题， 证明你的 background洗脑比我们大陆厉害多了， 起码 ...

You may be right, I was born in Hong Kong, all the teachers, grandparent friends were National defeated armies or official, the hatre of TG is crazy, you don't know that, all my life was told how bad was Communist China

DinC

好好的一个还原历史的贴子又被糟蹋了。

jerrygarry

蓝山小野猫商铺 发表于 2014-9-10 14:59
民主 一天到晚喊 民主。。。

你倒是告诉我什么是民主？？？！！！

We have this arguament before, bring it to those Hong Kong pages, thousand of them for you to argue, you never accept our point of view, there will be no ground to argue.

『「我們（英國人）五十年前就可以給予香港民主，但若然這樣做，中國會爆發，甚至入侵香港，這是我們的憂慮。」和黃前董事總經理馬世民（Simon Murray）在一次報章專訪中這樣說。一直以來，親北京的公眾人物和報章評論，甚至一般市民，都質疑英國為何百年來都不給香港民主，要到1984 年《聯合聲明》簽署，香港前途確定以後，「才大搞民主」。其實，只要稍讀英帝國歷史，就知道在二次大戰結束後，英國在絕大部份殖民地，都實行政治改革，逐 步建立由當地公民普選產生的政府，以達至獨立（如馬來西亞），或自治（如1959年的新加坡、今日的直布羅陀）。這裏所講的自治（Self- Government），是指除了國防外交，有時還包括內部保安繼續由英國負責外，所有事務都交由當地民選政府全權處理』

『大家或會問，假若當時英國堅持給香港民主自治，中方會如何回應呢？1960年10月29日，當時出任「華僑事務委員會」主任的廖承志，與香港工會代表訪京團聚會時，批評當時美國人建議在新界建立「自治政府」，並警告英方：
「英國不會喜歡美國這個建議，是無容置疑的。。。。。。美帝國主義者將永遠不會成功。可是，若這個建議是由英方提出的，就是另一回事了，到此非常時刻，我們將毫不猶疑採取積極行動，解放香港、九龍和新界。」
廖承志上述講話的原文，引自FCO 40/327。此文件版權為英國國家檔案館(National Archive)所有。』

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:02
You may be right, I was born in Hong Kong, all the teachers, grandparent friends were National def ...

这就对了， 你接受这些一面倒的负面资讯和教育， 和七八十年代中国一面倒的证明宣传教育， 本质有和区别？

不是洗脑是什么？， 单凭这片面资讯就判断一个事物的好坏， 不好意思， 连我这个被共党洗脑的大陆人也做不出， 我不懂你民主了这么久，为什么反而做到了.

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:05
We have this arguament before, bring it to those Hong Kong pages, thousand of them for you to argu ...

这就是你懂的历史？ 从评论文章得来的？ 那和“爱国爱港”一样， 说六四后中共坦克要开到香港的”推理“有何区别？
我以为我们大陆人可怜， 从小被奴化洗脑教育， 终于摆脱出国了， 看到部分香港人原来更加可怜, 我们最多被洗脑没有知识， 原来这部分香港人连常识都没， 一山还有一山高啊。

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 15:05
这就对了， 你接受这些一面倒的负面资讯和教育， 和七八十年代中国一面倒的证明宣传教育， 本质有和区别？ ...

So that's the reasons why this kind of arguements will be here forever, only if we are like the Iraqi kills all the other parties, then there will only be one voice

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:09
So that's the reasons why this kind of arguements will be here forever, only if we are like the Ir ...

Iraqi被民主西方忽悠才落得如此下场， 不好意思， 我不认为中国人会笨成这样.

我们不需要" one voice"，相反， 中国确实需要多个声音，特别像你一样的， 好让国内没机会出国的人， 看看原来民主国家同样出洗脑严重的人， 别以为只有中国才洗脑.

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 15:13
Iraqi被民主西方忽悠才落得如此下场， 不好意思， 我不认为中国人会笨成这样.

我们不需要" one voice ...

This article really sum up your difference to us

http://euan-macdonald.blogspot.c ... ern-journalism.html

1. Undermining the credibility of Western journalism, or the journalism practiced in democracies. In Russia, and other autocratic regimes, the media serve the purposes of the state. There is no conception of the media as a "Fourth Estate" that is in effect as separate and equal part of government, performing an overseeing role that protects democracy. Why should the media perform such a role when there is no democracy to protect? Instead, in authoritarian states, the media are an arm of government, a propganda appendage, who pass only the government-approved message. By extension, it is assumed, wrongly, by the people who live under autocratic regimes, that the Western media serve exactly the same role. The reporting of Western journalists is thus undermined, with journalists being equated to agents of their governments, and thought of as nothing better than propagandists or spies. This wooly thinking even infects the well-meaning but naive liberal left in the West, who (rightly) distrust their own governments, but (wrongly) won't believe their own media. Meanwhile, the "journalists" of an authoritarian state like Russia can be found in places like Ukraine advancing the goals of their state through their "reporting."

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 15:13
Iraqi被民主西方忽悠才落得如此下场， 不好意思， 我不认为中国人会笨成这样.

我们不需要" one voice ...

I quite like the way you blame the west for Iraqi killing themself!

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:14
This article really sum up your difference to us

http://euan-macdonald.blogspot.co.nz/2014/09/h ...

你引用这段， 又一次证明了你对人类社会制度的无知， 媒体的作用， 无论哪个国家， 从来都是选择性报道的， 就如你不会在西方媒体看到多少中国积极正面的题材， 同样，在中国媒体也多数看到西方的负面题材,

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 15:20
你引用这段， 又一次证明了你对人类社会制度的无知， 媒体的作用， 无论哪个国家， 从来都是选择性报道的 ...

Did you read the article?

It say something media is not controlled in the west, but you keep saying it is, anyway you been brainwashed your way, and I been influenced to my way.

The main issue is my way is not forced but yours are................

That's the difference

Bowang

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:22
Did you read the article?

It say something media is not controlled in the west, but you keep sa ...

其实，谈不到什么民主这些问题上来，
不就是想搞清楚历史真相吗？

其实这个很简单，比如研究明史，清史的，很多都去参考朝鲜的史料和记录，因为那是中立的。

同样，研究抗战史，无论是中共，国民党，甚至是日本的记录，都可能很大偏颇，
但是，研究美国的记录，采访和报道。可能就相对公正了吧。

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 15:22
Did you read the article?

It say something media is not controlled in the west, but you keep sa ...

这就是我说你被洗脑自己都不知道的原因， 竟然还相信这世界有真正自由不受控制的媒体， 好可怜，

brainwashed or influenced ,随你用词， 但改变不了事实的本质.

jerrygarry

bintoo 发表于 2014-9-10 15:59
这就是我说你被洗脑自己都不知道的原因， 竟然还相信这世界有真正自由不受控制的媒体， 好可怜，
...

That's the biggest problem of you, you use your moral stardard and understanding of human being to judge the others, it only proved one thing, you never integrated to the NZ Society, so it goes back to my earlier question why bother?
Usual flaw of Mainland Chinese, if I am a slave you need to be a slave too, don't know that the world is a much bigger place, than just being slave. Anyway it is very boring it has been years I have been discussing with you guys.

You guys always use your view to judge and never integrate to the country you call home......................... Just wondering how much you missed.

bintoo

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 16:12
That's the biggest problem of you, you use your moral stardard and understanding of human being to ...

你连基本的人性都不懂， 还谈什么由人组成的社会？ 更加没这个知识面去谈管理社会的制度了,

同样， 我是否integrated to the NZ Society你也没有能力去判断， 所以我建议你在这些问题上， 还是别bother了

七种武器之喷子

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 16:12
That's the biggest problem of you, you use your moral stardard and understanding of human being to ...

The problem with NBC or integrated hker is "you think you are kiwi,but everyone else recognize you as Chinese "

jerrygarry

七种武器之喷子 发表于 2014-9-10 16:42
The problem with NBC or integrated hker is "you think you are kiwi,but everyone else recognize you ...

I think you are wrong - join this group : )

https://www.facebook.com/groups/asiansinz/

tina223

jerrygarry 发表于 2014-9-10 14:49
My background have taught me nothing good from totalirian government - so that's my background

...

ppl, despite the fact that you've been bragging bout how set in your ways you are as a NZ chinese, you don't come off as one cos really I can't make much of what you wrote?

aalleexx

tina223 发表于 2014-9-10 18:17
ppl, despite the fact that you've been bragging bout how set in your ways you are as a NZ chinese, ...

大家都在飙英文啊，我也来。 欢迎改正错误。

It is obvious that people do have psychological relations to our homeland, religion, ethics, political systems or even some political parties, no matter how it makes us feel, good or bad, especially those factors we grew up with. However, we are entitled to have our own opinion or prejudice or stereotype about anything, nothing wrong about it.

For people from different country, religion or political systems, to which we are attached psychologically or subconsciously, discussion of these topics usually end up with personal insult.

People do have feelings, even as we all hate our shortcoming or bad habits, we feel insulted and become defensive when others joke about it, not to mention those complicated topics usually could be interpreted in different ways from different perspectives.

Sometimes some opinion may not be so popular to others as you expect, especially when people felt they were rub nose into, even if the opinion is correct even the absolute truth. One must be careful about the expression of their opinion of these sensitive topics. People always tend to listen to someone honest, empathetic with a good intention, and resist the one with attitude which make them feel uncomfortable, we all are human after all.

masterq

aalleexx 发表于 2014-9-10 18:38
大家都在飙英文啊，我也来。 欢迎改正错误。

It is obvious that people do have psychological relat ...

aalleexx

masterq 发表于 2014-9-10 18:43

， 我要哭了。
不过，有没有可能是你英文比我还差啊。。。。

masterq

aalleexx 发表于 2014-9-10 18:43
， 我要哭了。
不过，有没有可能是你英文比我还差啊。。。。

aalleexx

masterq 发表于 2014-9-10 18:45

我读的书少，唔好玩我哦。

anzac_corp

Bowang 发表于 2014-9-10 14:34
好啊，好啊，
咱们俩来，
我举一个国民党的例子，你举一个共产党的例子，

好啊，讲共产党假抗日真卖国你不舒服了么？时至今日主流宣传上仍然充斥了对那段历史的谎言和欺骗。在我们谴责日本历史教科书问题的同时，是不是也需要对我们自己的历史也反省反省，还历史以本来面目？有什么不自信的？

tina223

aalleexx 发表于 2014-9-10 18:38
大家都在飙英文啊，我也来。 欢迎改正错误。

It is obvious that people do have psychological relat ...

terrible..................

aalleexx

tina223 发表于 2014-9-10 20:26
terrible..................

you can not just "terrible..." me. why terrible, grammar? syntax? or logic?