房产开发五年之后卖不交税对吗？今天听说私人名下开发不卖可能也会预交GST

zhong5487

比如2020年一月买了个房子，私人名下，然后2022年分割后盖好了4-6套，然后出租，直到2025年一月再卖出，是不是就算过了明线，不交税了，出租几年交个人所得税就好了？
我咨询了会计，是那么告诉我的，感觉那也太简单了，捂得住的，这么操作也是挺好的，挺简单的，我一直觉得开发后拿到新的几套房子ccc后需要再开始五年明线计算呢



今天听人说他一个朋友也是私人名下开发后没有卖，直接收到ird要预收gst的钱，以后卖了后多退少补，把盖出来的房子先给个预估价，按预估价交gst,你可以反驳，打官司就是，横竖都是交钱，到底有没靠谱会计，收费可以，没问题，有没有真的懂的会计啊，政府认定你是开发行为，怎么操作都是要割你一大刀的感觉。。。

zhong5487

peach1012 发表于 2021-4-3 21:05
我是个新手所以谢谢你的分享。
那后来你的开发计划仍在进行吗？还是搁置了？我问的后面那个问题有了解过 ...

还在进行，我了解了私人借贷，太贵了，要百分之12.但是打款快，没有要求，商业贷款也费劲的，给钱也费劲，一步一步给，批也严格，我想着等bc下来了再看吧，新手最好是用四大银行的利率才负担的起，实在不行，盖的时候卖房拿钱盖吧，反正利息也不抵税了，慢慢弄吧，走一步看一步，总而言之，这个钱没有想象的那么好赚了，前几年那批盖的早的确实赚钱的，以后会越来越难，新手，现金流少的，谨慎为妙

peach1012

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-4-2 13:57
that is a good question.

The property I am selling was purchased in 2005 for $300k and is now mort ...

谢谢大佬分享哈。

看来你是那种享受到了地产红利，现金量比较充足的人。这么看来，那么你开发完毕，不卖房子，就拿着，也是能一下子还清开发贷款的对吗？
还是说你其实钱多到，根本不用贷款救能开发了？谢谢哈

peach1012

zhong5487 发表于 2021-4-2 13:49
别的我不确定，但是卖掉房子，那个房子可能你买来100万，贷款60万，但是现在可以卖150了啊，难道原价卖啊 ...

我是个新手所以谢谢你的分享。
那后来你的开发计划仍在进行吗？还是搁置了？我问的后面那个问题有了解过吗？开发项目的商业贷款是不是真的周期很短呢？

bungyjumping999

peach1012 发表于 2021-4-2 11:49
哥们你好，看了几个你的回复，方不方便粗略的问几个关于你的开发策略的问题 ？

你提到，卖出手上一套房 ...

that is a good question.

The property I am selling was purchased in 2005 for $300k and is now mortgage-free. So can bring in some $ for the project.
When tofu was buying units, I bought full site properties. At that time, many criticized as "poor cash flow" but I made it to the end and now mostly mortgage-free due to low interest. Also, I only invest in North shore, my targetted market.

zhong5487

peach1012 发表于 2021-4-2 11:49
哥们你好，看了几个你的回复，方不方便粗略的问几个关于你的开发策略的问题 ？

你提到，卖出手上一套房 ...

别的我不确定，但是卖掉房子，那个房子可能你买来100万，贷款60万，但是现在可以卖150了啊，难道原价卖啊，那不就手里多了70.80万了，储备地的话当然便宜的时候储备才好，19年100万，现在要150万，肯定早搞早好啊，问题是之前大家都不懂屯大地，懂的时候普通人大地下手就很困难了

我自己房子我是要一分四个独栋，总共面积600多点平米，之前我还想着2000一平包税可以盖起来，也就120万，在加分割费40万好了，开发出来准备165左右应该够了，现在2000可盖不出来，我估计我得准备200万开发成本才能够，反正计划不如变化的

peach1012

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-2-22 17:03
Many ordinary people do not want to be a developer. They probably do it once in their lifetime. i am ...

哥们你好，看了几个你的回复，方不方便粗略的问几个关于你的开发策略的问题 ？

你提到，卖出手上一套房产，然后再贷款，这样造房子的钱就有了。请问下是你当初买房的现金储量特别大吗，不然我我理解的是，如果如果100多万的房子，基本上贷款也有4，5成吧，这样卖掉，好像也没多少钱呀？感觉不够你去造4 -5 个联排 ？
另外，土地的开发贷款，期限不是都挺短的吗？我听说好像几年就要还了，如果你造好了房子不卖，怎么还上贷款呢？租金再多也没法一下子还上贷款吧？
最后，这个土地储备是不是要在很早以前就要进行了？
期待回复。谢谢。

zhong5487

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-29 21:06
http://bbs.skykiwi.com/forum.php ... 2218&extra=page%3D1

this lady sounds knowledgeable and is rele ...

谢谢你啊，我问问看去，这些讲座都挺好，就是时间太长，听着费劲，要是小编整理一下成文字就好了，几分钟就看完了

bungyjumping999

http://bbs.skykiwi.com/forum.php ... 2218&extra=page%3D1

this lady sounds knowledgeable and is relevant to what we discussed here.

zhong5487

是个狼灭 发表于 2021-3-29 17:26
你会计的证是假的吧，要不要找找我的会计

好啊，私信我一下联系方式呗，谢谢啦，好会计真的难找

是个狼灭

你会计的证是假的吧，要不要找找我的会计

zhong5487

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-28 21:15
May be "his friend" is a registered GST person and has been claiming GST rebate for other projects. ...

哦，还有那么一说，那可能是的，那个人就是有盖房子的，只是分割是私人名下第一次，我就觉得普通人一个大地私人名下，都没卖还要交什么预估值的gst太不合理了，都没有利润，怎么交，你说的还挺有道理的

bungyjumping999

zhong5487 发表于 2021-3-28 20:29
今天听人说他一个朋友也是私人名下开发后没有卖，直接收到ird要预收gst的钱，以后卖了后多退少补，把盖出 ...

May be "his friend" is a registered GST person and has been claiming GST rebate for other projects.

If the person is already labelled as "developer", this "build and hold" won't work.

zhong5487

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-27 18:02
yes, you are right.

That is why I need more than one opinion and my own investigations.

今天听人说他一个朋友也是私人名下开发后没有卖，直接收到ird要预收gst的钱，以后卖了后多退少补，把盖出来的房子先给个预估价，按预估价交gst,你可以反驳，打官司就是，横竖都是交钱，到底有没靠谱会计，收费可以，没问题，有没有真的懂的会计啊，政府认定你是开发行为，怎么操作都是要割你一大刀的感觉。。。
早就听人说过，横算竖算，你都算不过政府，资本主义国家，褥羊毛

bungyjumping999

onetreehill1 发表于 2021-3-27 17:40
If LZ accountant answered the bright-line test correctly, then I think LZ won't be worry about payi ...

yes, you are right.

That is why I need more than one opinion and my own investigations.

In the beginning, I was not sure and asked for written advice and paid the professional fee etc, In NZ, there is such thing as "negligent Misstatement" and professionals can be sued if they give wrong advice as they hold themselves up "as expert".


Also, there is no point to give a disclaimer, the Court will interpret if that disclaimer is valid in the circumstances and the consumer paid a fee for that advice.

I am serious about my planning and I know cheap/free advice can be useless.

onetreehill1

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-27 16:43
The question by LZ to his accountant is on bright-line test.
The accountant answered the bright-lin ...

If LZ accountant answered the bright-line test correctly, then I think LZ won't be worry about paying Tax, as he said in his another post===> http://bbs.skykiwi.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=4011536&extra=page%3D1   this could be his one time only development as he wanna retire early or go overseas to enjoy life, so I still think his accountant gave wrong advice or just dug a pit and induce LZ jump in to make more money from LZ?

bungyjumping999

还是回国吧 发表于 2021-3-27 16:50
Depends on the quality of the accountant, the experience, the specific questions LZ asked, etc, et ...

yes, comrade, you are always my hero.

还是回国吧

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-27 16:43
The question by LZ to his accountant is on bright-line test.
The accountant answered the bright-lin ...

Depends on the quality of the accountant, the experience, the specific questions LZ asked, etc, etc, etc.

Discussing here is only for fun, ultimately, if the accountant stepped wrongly, IRD will come knocking, just ask that 新马 comrade...haha

bungyjumping999

onetreehill1 发表于 2021-3-27 16:30
Ok，that means the LZ's accountant gave wrong advice, but some people in this post said his accoun ...

The question by LZ to his accountant is on bright-line test.
The accountant answered the bright-line test correctly and it was discussed.


But LZ might not have asked for advice on "development, profit, and its implications" apart from the bright-line test. The development issues and tax involves more than just the bright-line test. that is why he said "我咨询了会计，是那么告诉我的，感觉那也太简单了"

I had an in-depth discussion with an accountant in this area and also do my own research, indeed, it is not as simple as that.

onetreehill1

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-27 16:22
This question is very challenging.

I had thought of this question before, it is risky according to ...

Ok，that means the LZ's accountant gave wrong advice, but some people in this post said his accountant might be right, so just confused.

bungyjumping999

onetreehill1 发表于 2021-3-27 16:10
OK, my question is if someone is in similar situation as yours, in 2022 sell one house from the su ...

This question is very challenging.

I had thought of this question before, it is risky according to someone i talked to. There is a high chance IRD will see you as a developer if you do that.  The development can be contrued as substantial changing from the original site to a few lots (3 or more).

There is a definition of "what is substantial development" on the IRD website. A subdivision of 2 lots from the family house looks okay, this can be explained to IRD and might get an exemption.


If the development involving more than 2 lots and offered for sale subsequently (even just 1 lot), it is considered substantial and hence taxable activity.

挡风玻璃维修

你们真能折腾 我买房都是起码hold10年起步 人年纪大了搞不过来

onetreehill1

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-3-27 10:17
This is on a "case to case basis"

I have owned the land since 2012, so more than 9 years for renta ...

OK, my question is if someone is in similar situation as yours, in 2022 sell one house from the subdivided house pool to offset the subdivision and construction costs, will he be liable to pay tax for selling one house? the rest of houses will be rented out and surely will pay IR3 income tax for the rental income. (not a developer and it's life time only development)

bungyjumping999

onetreehill1 发表于 2021-3-27 01:08
Ｉhave a question about "hold for more than 10 years".  how to define this 10 years? start from se ...

This is on a "case to case basis"

I have owned the land since 2012, so more than 9 years for rental.

The construction will likely to complete in 2022 (with titles and CCC), and will continue to rent them out.

I will use 10 years from 2022 as a guideline, to dispel my intention to make a profit on the development project but purely to provide rental accommodation and will pay "rental income tax on them" (IR3).

To put it simply,  my intention was never to sell them, circumstances might change after 10 years, accountant said, I can easily get clearance from IRD.



As to recent tax changes, my opinion is "it will wipe out the weak, the strong will get stronger"

onetreehill1

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-2-22 13:28
Pay for professional accountant advice, ask them to put it in writing, even it costs $600-800

This  ...

Ｉhave a question about "hold for more than 10 years".  how to define this 10 years? start from settlement day of original property purchased to subdivision and construction completion day (the date of new houses CCC issued?)

bungyjumping999

kammie 发表于 2021-3-15 03:36
請問找了工地經理然後在他的帮助下建完一套自住房，沒貸款然後放在trust 的名下，也是遵守這個十年規則嗎 ...

If it is your family home (main home), bright-line does not apply to you.

金庸大师

kammie 发表于 2021-3-15 03:36
請問找了工地經理然後在他的帮助下建完一套自住房，沒貸款然後放在trust 的名下，也是遵守這個十年規則嗎 ...

自住个人名下应该不用交税，但是如果你是累犯，那就跑不掉，这么大额的资金就不要问免费的咨询了，问问专业会计更好，不要因小失大。中间转了一次trust，就不知是啥情况了

kammie

bungyjumping999 发表于 2021-2-22 13:53
A general guideline will be 10 years to dispel "intention" to make a profit and is a genuine inve ...

請問找了工地經理然後在他的帮助下建完一套自住房，沒貸款然後放在trust 的名下，也是遵守這個十年規則嗎？目前住快三年了但離上班的地點太遠所以想賣，但不知道房子以什麼價值來交稅呢？謝謝！

Lease

comsuntech 发表于 2021-2-22 17:58
预售的钱不能用为什么要预售，ps一张概念图就能起家的时代

预售的目的是为了锁定买家以及出售价格，并不是为了用预售的钱来开发， 预收款必须进律师的 trust 账户，开发商是不能用的， 因为钱如果到了开发商手里， 万一项目中途流产，买家的预付款就会损失。这样的作法是为了保护买家.

xli422

开发完卖了一分钱都不交税 然后跑路回国 happy ending.......